RP Class 2

Taught by Kyyel. Advanced RP Basics

May 31, 2002

OOC Class and Demonstration Room
[Use +desc to describe this room. Use +done to clear it once you're finished.]
-=-=-=-=-=-=Real Objects=-=-=-=-=-=-
=> Mailyn
=> Aurejin
=> Petra
=> Kyyel
=> Tariff_Dar
=> Dibar
=> Seth_Dextar
=> Simon
-=-=-=-=-=Visible exits=-=-=-=-=-
Out leads to OOC Entertainment Nexus.

Kyyel sets his notes up and then smiles, "Looks like we have a good turnout... alright then, I'll wait a moment to see if any last people dive in, then we'll begin.

Kyyel grins, "Yeah yeah, alright then, any one else can show up late and read the log later. :) Class is now in session!

Simon stops eating crayons and pays attention to Kyyel.
Mira hides her paper airplane

Kyyel says, "Once again, to keep this going as smoothly as possible, I ask that all random comments cease. If you have a question or statement you'd like to make, just go ahead and page me first, and I will call on you. :) Now then... let's go onto our first subject for the night."

Kyyel says, "Our first topic will be covering something I touched upon at the last class, but I'm going to go into it in more detail here: NPCs"

Kyyel says, "Now, as to where to start with them; we've all dealt with an NPC at some point or another, even without realizing it. These are the crowds of people you're walking through, the guards stationed at doors, bartenders and waitresses, random droids, etc..."

Kyyel says, "Generally though, they don't make a BIG impact in RP, except making a brief appearance in maybe one pose out of an RP. This generally should be the case as well; large events or specific actions should be handled by PCs whenever possible. This is to allow players to have the feeling that they're helping to work with the plot directly, rather than having someone else do it for them."

Kyyel says, "Anyone have any questions or comments so far?"

Mira shakes
Techra is good, "Just observing before i leave
Seth_Dextar smiles."nope"

Simon says, "If you have a bunch of 'heroes', is it okay to have an NPC that makes a big impact in that it is the bad guy for the heroes to deal with? I've done that in the past. I think it's an exception to the general rule."

Kyyel nods, "A good point Simon; I've done that myself. Yes... generally if the NPC is the major antagonist for the 'heroes', then that's something where it's generally OK to have them do a few things to help move the plot along. However, at the same time, you don't want them to be completely overbearing.

Mira tends to think that in situations like that, or where an NPC is needed to make a big impact in general, that if the other people in the scene are aware of and okay with the use of the NPC, that it's okay. And if the NPC is going to do anything long lasting or traumatic to the PC, the PC should consent to it before it happens.

Simon nods.
Kyyel nods, "A very good point Mira. Consent is a very important thing in regards to a NPC like that."
Tariff_Dar nods in agrrment

Kyyel says, "Now... does anyone else have any other questions or comments? Remember, page me first if you do. :)"
Kyyel says, "Okay then, since no one replied, we're moving on."

Kyyel says, "Which actually was briefly mentioned by Mira there... the next thing I am going to discuss for the night is Consent."

Kyyel says, "Now then, consent can be the greatest asset to RP, and at the same time, it can also put several large and intimidating knots into the flow of it as well. Consent however, is also what our entire system here is based on, so I feel it is extremely important that we discuss it."

Kyyel says, "Simon."

Simon says, "Consent is the cornerstone... the MOST IMPORTANT aspect to roleplaying on a MUSH. Everything hinges on it."

Kyyel says, "Tariff."

Tariff_Dar says, "yes i agree Consent is important...but not the most important thing....if you have to ask to do EVERYTHING then why do we have different factions...locks on hiouse/doors/objects...there is a limit to the Consent policy...thats why we have JUDGEs isnt it?"

Kyyel says, "Judges are used to help arbitrate debates between players when they cannot work out a solution between themselves. In effect, they are to make a final call on something that happens in an RP if a question arises that cannot be settled by the players alone."

Kyyel says, "Simon again."

Simon says, "The idea of a MUSH is mutual enjoyment of the story. Mutual enjoyment can not happen without consent. Consent, when you break it down, is really about cooperation. The goal of a scene on a MUSH is to cooperate to make the best story possible."

Simon says, "You can have disagreements and still have consentual roleplay."

Kyyel says, "Mira."

Mira thinks its important to remember that the point of MUSHing, or this MUSH, anyway, isn't to win, but to build a story cooperatively.

Kyyel nods, "Very good point Mira. Simon. ;)"

Simon says, "When it comes down to it, even when you call a Judge, you cooperate or consent to allow an arbitrator dictate the outcome of a disagreement. It is not the only way to solve disagreements."

Kyyel says, "Tariff."

Tariff_Dar says, "i agree with all of this, I'm just saying that you should not always have consent for everything...do you get consent from someone to buy them a drink at one of the bars,no....we they don't want it they RP it out."

Kyyel says, "Alright, I have a comment on that myself..."

Kyyel says, "At that point, buying someone a drink is an IC action... which generally should be taken care of ICly. The person can't say 'no you can't do that', because your character very well might. Otherwise you begin to have people powerposing. Simon has a comment that I feel answers this point well."

Simon says, "There are circumstances where consent is implied by your actions. For example, when you draw your blaster and start shooting at a squad of stormtroopers, you are implying consent to being shot back at, as well as the other consequences that come along with making such a bold move."

Kyyel nods, "That is VERY true. You can't blast at someone or something and then call say you do not consent to being shot back at, or in similar cases... there are a few RARE cases where they may not get a chance to fire back, such as a sniper, but in those cases the details should be worked out beforehand with the other player.

Kyyel says, "Tariff has a question."

Tariff_Dar says, "ok, but say you are wandering around a planet you haven't been on before. You come to 'so ans so's house'. The door is unlocked or has no lock...do you have to wait..hours, days, for that person to log on to get Consent to enter?"

Kyyel says, "I think that's the case for people to learn to lock their doors. However, if they find you wandering around in there ICly, don't expect a warm reaction unless you know em."

Kyyel says, "Does anyone else have any other comments or questions?"
Seth_Dextar shakes his head.

Kyyel says, "Mira. :)"

Tariff_Dar says, "understood. I then consent to whatever actions happen to me after I enter...so then if im not suppose to be there, i accept whatever consequences...sorry I didn't raise my ahnd"

Kyyel says, "No problem, but yes, that's right Tariff. :)"

Mira would think that you should think about what your character would do ICly and what kind of security would be in place for the appropriate area. Does your character normally wander up to someone's house and just let themselves in and look around? Or waltz into restricted areas? Some places have NPC security, and just b/c no one is on to go "Hey, no, you can't go in there there are guards," doesn't mean you should be able to just walk in anyway hoping that no one signs on and finds you there.

Kyyel nods again to Mira. Also, I know that some places have a warning either posted on a sign or written within the end of the description to let you know about stuff like that; but it's not always the case and you should keep it in mind.
You say, "And if there is a warning there, you definitely need to find someone to get permission."

Kyyel says, "Now at the same time, if you also get captured, or detain another character... as much as you may like to, you can't keep them locked into a single room for the rest of their character's life. First off, it's horribly boring (Anyone who's ever been captured can tell you that), and secondly it basically ends the character. Now, if a situation like that looks like it's coming up... either in the middle of a fight that's going bad for you, or you have security closing in... again, talk to the people OOCly to figure out how to have the scene end with all parties being satisfied... that may end up with you being captured for a brief time then escaping."

Seth_Dextar nods.
Kyyel says, "Well then, does anyone else have anything they'd like to add?"
Seth_Dextar shakes his head. "no sir"
Kyyel nods, "Anyone else or shall I move on?

Tariff_Dar has more on Consent but will talk to the teacher after class...don't want to hold anyone up
Kyyel says, "Go ahead Tariff."
Kyyel smiles, "This is the place to ask questions.

Tariff_Dar says, "we;ll, i had a similair encounter, where i was somewhere i wans't suppose to be. Yes, looking back i suppose I was in the wrong. There was NPC security, cameras a such. But i did pose around them, no one tried to stop me, though there was people logged on that could have stopped me. It would take to long to explain the whole thing, but if my character had the ability to (skills/attributes) avoid the security, shouldn't that be acceptable for my entery?"

Kyyel says, "Yes and no."

Kyyel says, "First off... with something like sneaking into a base, you should be RPing it with someone in some way, even if they're running the NPCs. Most bases with security like you describe use some of their best people to help guard it. Again, you should discuss that with those that are logged in; if there is no one near the building you're trying to sneak into, find out which organization owns it and then contact someone from there. It's unlikely you'd have to wait too long to get some kind of response."

Kyyel says, "Simon has something to say to that."

Simon says, "To help answer Tariff's question, I'd say that if/when someone has a problem with something you're doing, or questions your ability to do something, then it's their responsibility to call you on it and pose questions. That's when +checks and Judges and things can come into play, though not necessarily."

Kyyel says, "Simon has something he wants to add, the Tariff has another comment."
Simon says, "As an addendum to that, it's still your responsibility to make sure that the actions you are taking appropriate for your character, both in terms of personality and skill."

Tariff_Dar says, "I do realize now I should have found someone to Rp me not entering...or did a +check with me or something, but when I wa s disovered (where I wans't souppose to be) the person that did, didn't even try to RP out the situation..which i though was in poor taste"

Kyyel says, "Again, I wasn't present at the situation, so I really can't comment on it."

Kyyel says, "Seth now has a question/comment?"

Seth_Dextar smiles. "So in other words, a mechanic or doctor would be a lot less likely to pull a blaster in a situation if most of their skill points went to say...droid repair, or something? Right."

Kyyel says, "Nope. Not at all... that depends on their mentality... less points just means they're a worse shot. :)"

Seth_Dextar nods and goes back into silence :)

Kyyel says, "Dibar wants to make a comment, then I'm going to wrap up this section."

Dibar says, "I think there's also somewhat of a burden on whoever owns a particular area, to present a clear understanding to those entering, exactly what is going on. In some cases, they may need to be as blunt as an OOC sign that explains what the security is like, and if there are any questions, who to contact. (Something I've done before)."

Kyyel says, "Very good point Dibar."

Kyyel says, "Now then, I'm going to wrap up this part and move onto the next section... my last comment regarding Consent is that generally, use your best judgement on how to handle things; you know better than anyone how your character will act. Also, there really shouldn't be anything to keep you from speaking OOCly during an RP to clarify things. As was stated earlier, we're all here to have fun, so let's do our best to make sure everyone has an enjoyable time.""

Seth_Dextar golf claps

You say, "A general note: If you have a problem with something, bringing it up _during_ the RP is always better (and more fixable) than afterwards."

Kyyel says, "Exactly. :)"

Kyyel says, "Now then, onto a more... tricky subject that comes up rarely, but should still be addressed. The next section is going to be covering the Force and how it can be used in RP."

Kyyel says, "Mira, Simon? If you two could come up to help me with this part? :)"
Mira pops up
Simon pops up, too.

Kyyel says, "Now then... let's begin. The Force, when you really break it down, is just another set of skills for a character OOCly. ICly though, it can let them do some pretty amazing stuff. Now, this can be daunting for people to RP around... or they may not be sure exactly how to respond."

Kyyel says, "In general though, you're going to get different reactions based on the mentality of the force user... a Light side user will not react in the same way as a Dark side user. One tends to be much kinder and more forgiving than the other. However, one thing to keep in mind... nine times out of ten you won't know that they're a FU (Force User for those not aware) or not."

Simon says, "In general, the way to deal with Force Characters is just to stay in YOUR character. If you eliminate the idea of the Force... eliminate all of the things you have learned about the Force from the movies... and you are looking through the eyes of your character and you see something unbelieveable happen, react as your character would react."

You say, "It's important to remember that in our timeline, the Force is considered a silly Myth by most people. Kind of like magic or witches are thought of today, I guess."

Kyyel nods, "Excellent points. And also remember that right now, we're at a time period in the game where there are VERY few Force Users in the galaxy. So unless you see them do something completely spectacular, more likely than not, they'll look like every other player... another good point to remember; though ICly only FUs can really wield a Lightsaber, someone having one does not immediately equal FU."

Kyyel says, "Simon has another point in this same thought."

Simon says, "This is another area where CONSENT is EXTREMELY IMPORTANT. If someone were to wander into an area with their hood up, you'd work with them in a consentual manner to determine if you can see them or recognize them or not. In the same way, if someone wanders into an area with a coded lightsaber on their person, it's important that you work with that person to determine if you see it, rather than assume they have it dangling from their hip with a big neon sign on it."

You say, "Definitely. And, unless you've seen one before, you probably wouldn't know what it was."
Kyyel says, "For all you know, it might be a flashlight or glowrod."

Kyyel says, "Does anyone have any comments or questions right now?"
Kyyel says, "Anyone? Ok then... we'll continue on with this one."

Kyyel says, "Essentially, those are the key points you should keep in mind when dealing with FUs on here... oh! Another very good point... unless you've had a great deal of interaction with FUs, you probably wouldn't be able to tell the difference between a lightsider and a darksider... their actions may translate VERY differently to different people."

Kyyel says, "Example: The Cantina in Mos Eisley when Obi-Wan chops off the thing's arm before it turns Luke into a small smear on the ground. Someone may see that and see this imposing figure wielding an archaic weapon and cutting down someone merely trying to defend themselves. Others who might have either known the thug might have put their sympathies with the old man helping a friend. But in all honesty, there's no big sign above Obi Wan flashing 'I am a nice person'"

Kyyel says, "But, that's also kind of common sense too. :)"

Kyyel says, "Soooo... anyone want to ask anything or is everyone asleep?"
Petra raises a hand
Kyyel says, "Yes Petra."

Petra says, "As I caught just the part about the FU's....I would just sort of ask your recommendation of how to react if you see an 'unusual' phenomena.... is it still something that is rare and *woah* or is it more common place that most would take in stride..."

Petra says, "and you may have already answered that and I missed it *grins*"

Kyyel says, "It's more of rare and *woah* to most people. :)"

Tariff_Dar pops his head up and wipes the drool off of his notebook.
Kyyel grins.

Petra says, "What about to an Imperial"
Kyyel hmms...
Petra says, "I mean I guess I am thinking more from my situation..."

Kyyel says, "It depends on what your character may have seen... and I may be completely wrong on this, seeing how I'm not familiar with the Imperial doctrine here. So let's go to what evidence we can see from the films. More specifically the council upon the first Death Star."

Kyyel says, "It's clear that one Imperial in particular felt that the Force was nothing more than a outdated and useless religion, with Vader having strange if not unique abilities. The Emperor seemed to have hidden his own powers from the general populous, and even Tarkin felt that Vader was the 'last of their religion.' (Thanks goes to Simon for that little info there)"

Kyyel says, "You should probably discuss that with your CO Petra, to see what they may have learned. (Thanks to Mira for that one)"

Petra nodnods

Mira imagines that VK has a certain amount fo wariness/longing to kill FUs, but I'm not sure how much they teach their troops and how much is kept in the inner circles.

Simon says, "Because of the films, the Force is the area where OOC knowledge most often drifts into IC knowledge. Sometimes in ways that people don't even realize. For example, it's not common knowledge that there is a 'Light Side' and a 'Dark Side'."

Petra's mother was a member of the Imperial Royal Guard at one point so she probably would be aware ICly of some aspects...
Simon notes that, even being a Force Character, Simon doesn't believe there is a light side and a dark side.
Petra says, "Oh really?"
Simon nods.
Petra says, "What does he believe?"
You say, "That might be something you guys could take to page. ;)"
Kyyel nods. ;)
Tariff_Dar yawns.

Petra blushes and grins, "Sorry...I find that aspect of RP to be an area that is difficult for a lot of people (including myself) on the game because of the way OOC sorta blends with IC...but yes I will page..."

Kyyel says, "Now, in the NR though, the outlook on the Force is probably different, especially with how the Rebel Alliance used the Jedi salutation as their rallying cry. But I'm not entirely sure on that... but I think it would be safe to say that FUs in general are a little more believed in and accepted in NR space as a whole, rather than Imperial space."
Petra nods

Kyyel says, "However, a good thing that Simon brought up to me; Vader and the Emperor were killed by a Jedi Knight... so there is probably more belief in it now than the original trilogy presented. Also... Luke Skywalker was seen and accepted as a Jedi Knight in RotJ by the Alliance."

Dak nods

Simon says, "If the NR knows about Luke and his claims of being a Jedi, then the Imperials would know about it, too, which would help the distorted story of how Palpatine died spread."

Petra says, "So perhaps that means the whole idea of Force Users is a bit more wide spread now then it was in the original three movies?"

Simon says, "Much of the speculation in regards to Jedi and the Force can be cleared up in NEWS FORCE, though."

Petra nods
Kyyel nods again. :) Alright, does anyone else have anything they'd like to say or ask?
Kyyel says, "Tariff?"
Tariff_Dar says, "can we go on to the next topic?"
Kyyel was getting ready to anyway. :) I was just making sure we had all questions covered for the Force.
Tariff_Dar twiddles his thumbs paitently.

Kyyel says, "Now then, if we're all questioned out with that, I'll move onto the last subject for the evening."

Kyyel says, "The last subject I have for the evening is having ships posing in player rooms."

Tariff_Dar looks around with a confused look.

Kyyel says, "Now, this is pretty quick, and also a little bit of common sense in here as well. Unless you're in a starport, or a landing area, or something very similar to those two things, it's unlikely you'd be able to get a ship THAT close to a populated area that it would matter to the RP. Exceptions: Ships going out of control and crashing, large scale battles or seiges against cities. :)"

Tariff_Dar notices foreboding in Kyyel's voice.

Kyyel says, "The latter two can happen though... and I've been involved with both of them. But other than that, and having your ship taking off and landing, it's unlikely there would be much interaction between both starships and people."

Kyyel says, "Now then, does anyone have any last questions or comments?"
Kyyel says, "5.. 4.. 3.. 2.."

Kyyel says, "Tariff."

Tariff_Dar says, "one quick question going back to Consent. With the FOLLOW command, do you need to get consent for that, even though someone could simly use UNFOLLOW, DESERT, or DISMISS?"

You say, "Does the follow command working here?"
You say, "Me fail English? That's unpossible"

Kyyel doesn't think it works, but in general, yes. Simply for the OOC reason that it would be considered rude to just use the command on random people.

Tariff_Dar says, "I have never used it, but i assumed it worked. (as long as you pass all locks and stuff."

Aurejin has been 'followed' before. And yeah. It was rude. :)

Kyyel nods, "If you want to watch someone's RP that they're in, ask em. If you want to follow someone ICly, RP it with them.

Kyyel says, "Now then... is there anything else?"

Seth_Dextar shakes his head.

Tariff_Dar says, "so overall...ANY action you take on another player needs consent, with obvious common sense exceptions, correct?"

Seth_Dextar says, "thank you :)"

Kyyel nods. That is correct Tariff... now then, does anyone else have any other questions?
Tariff_Dar shakes his head and begins gathering his books and crayons.

Kyyel nods and smiles, "Alright then... that's it for our second RP class here," he looks over to Mira and Simon and bows, "Thank you two for your help today as well. :) Could not have done it without you."

Kyyel now puts a basket on the desk labeled 'Apples here'
You say, "Thanks, Kyyel. That was fun. :)"
Tariff_Dar says, "Yes, thank you"
Aurejin gives Kyyel an apple. Thanks. :)
Kyyel yays!
Dibar drops an apple in the basket. It looks funny, though...and has the words: "This end towards enemy" written on one facing.
Tariff_Dar hands Kyyel the apple PIE he baked, all by himself.
Mailyn has a caramel apple.
Kyyel oooos... caramel.
Petra cheers and hands Kyyel a box of brand new crayons.
Kyyel grins, "Alright guys, then head back to RP! Next class will be in a couple weeks.