Taught by Kyyel. Space and Space Combat

September 17th, 2002

Class and Demonstration Room

[Use +desc to describe this room. Use +done to clear it once you're finished.]
-=-=-=-=-=-=<>=-=-=-=-=-=-
=> Christopher
=> Darian
=> Vetch
=> Thomas
=> Nynaeve
=> Kyyel
=> Dises
=> Pallando
=> Dieter
-=-=-=-=-=<>=-=-=-=-=-
ut leads to Entertainment Nexus.

Kyyel says, "Okay guys, I'm giving one more minute, and then we begin."
Darian nods, yawns, and waits :)

Kyyel says, "Okay guys, I think that's everyone we're going to get, so I'm going to give off the rules for the class right now."
Kyyel says, "First rule, if you have a question or statement you'd like to make, page me first. Don't actually page me the statement, just say that you'd like to say something, or ask something. I will respond to you, but this is important, because I'm working on raw telnet."

Nynaeve says, "eek."
Darian winces. Yuck.

Kyyel says, "Second, if you plan on being disruptive or disturbing and generally making this a poor experience for anyone, please leave. This is a class to help out anyone who might need it, so let's respect that as well. Granted, I'm not expecting that from anyone here, but it's always good to say. :)"

Kyyel says, "And finally, please turn in any apples for the teacher at my desk, and we'll begin. ;)"

Darian throws an apple core!
Altair deposits an apple on the desk.
Kyyel calls cousin Guido to take care of Darian. :)

Kyyel says, "Now then, our first topic of the afternoon: RPing in space with ships."

Kyyel says, "Most of you here have probably been involved in some kind of space action, even if it's flying from point A to point B. Now, most people seem to get confused when they encounter another ship, and the other wants to RP."
Kyyel says, "Now, in space RP, the first thing you have to consider is what kind of ship you're flying. A fighter is going to move far differently than a freighter, and both of those are going to fly circles around even the most manuverable Capital ship.

Key points to remember about the ship classes are this:
Fighters can be very manuverable.
Freighters can be manuverable, but generally cannot keep up with a fighter.
Capital ships lumber, they don't manuver."

Kyyel says, "Now then, does anyone have any questions or want clarifications regarding this so far? Just raise your hand. :)"

Dieter raises his hand.
Kyyel says, "Dieter."

Dieter says, "Well, my alt flies in an extremely modified ILC. I know it's a lot larger than a fighter, but it's faster than an A-wing, and with his 7D piloting, isn't he able to pull of some outstanding stunts. It's ICly stressful to the ship to do these stunts, but maneuverability is like handling on a car. You can put your best race car driver in a Hemi-Cuda (which is fast and handles like a tank) versus a novice driver in a porsche. (Fast and maneuverable) The professional driver is gonna still outperform and pull off stunts that the novice driver can't do. Doesn't it all really come down to ability rather than the ship?"
Dieter says, "I know a VSD isn't gonna pull of any funky stunts, so it needs not apply to a cap ship."

Kyyel says, "Partially yes, but you have to understand that there are limits to even what a ship can do. Remember, Han Solo was one of the best pilots on the fringe, and yet even he could barely outmanuver the TIEs chasing him. You can pull off stunning manuvers, but remember, a fighter can pull off the same one in less time. It's just a smaller ship."

Kyyel says, "Altair also would like to say something in regards to that."
Kyyel says, "Altair, then Pallando."
Nesin raises his hand, also.
Kyyel nods, "One second Nes.

Altair says, "The professional driver in the heavy car might outperform the novice driver in the manuverable car, but if you put the professional driver in the porsche, he is going to be able to do stunts that he couldn't do in the heavier, less maneuverable car. It doesn't _all_ come down to ability, b/c there is still stuff even a pro can't do in the heavy ship, but ability can go a long way in making larger ships do impressive maneuvers. Part of this point probably comes up because of how the space combat handles maneuverability, in that it is mostly due to speed and not the maneuverability dice of the ship."

Kyyel says, "Now Pallando."
Pallando says, "I disagree with Kyyel that freighters and fighters fly circles around cap ships, sure they may be more manuerverable but its also a quesiton of speed in many cases the cap ship may be faster than the frieghter and so no the freighter will not fly circles around it."

Darian shrugs. "Just because it's that way in the space code (where speed is used, not maneuverability) doesn't mean that's the way it 'should' or 'would' happen. And when you're RPing things out, that should be taken into effect. If a fighter has a maneuverability of 4D, and a freighter has a maneuverability of 1D, and a SSD has a maneuverability of 0D, those should be taken into account into RP. ESPECIALLY if the current space code doesn't."
Darian says, "That is, just because the code works that way doesn't mean it should be RPed that way, because it's not right. :)"

Kyyel says, "Nesin now."
Nesin says, "Do stats majorly effect your ability to dodge Ship's weapons fire, and to actually shoot at other ships? (I have 5D+0, and couldn't get a shot off at an attacking ship the other day.) Also . .I noticed, Normally, I would +check around in the 20s for Starship Piloting. But yet I got hit considerably, with 12s as my defence score."

Kyyel says, "I'll cover that later when we get to combat Nesin."
Nesin eeps, and nods. "Okay, I wasn't sure if that was what you were talking about yet."
Kyyel says, "But rest assured I will remember. :) Now then, I have something to say to Pallando, and then Altair also has something."

Kyyel says, "It is true that a capital ship may be faster than a freighter or a fighter, however, there are several things you have to consider: The first, the capital ship will not have the same manuverability. ESB gives a perfect example of this, when Han doesn't outrun, but outmanuvers the persuing SDs. By all accounts from the movie, in a straight run, he would have been caught. You have to remember that even in a weightless environment, the fighter or freighter needs to use a lot less power to make a turn then a capital ship would."
Dieter raises his hand.

Pallando says, "I am not saying that the more maneuverable ships should rp differently that they dart more and the cap ships lumber but fly circles implies literally flying circles and if the cap ship can out pace the small more maneuverable vessel that matters too."
Pallando says, "Er weird negatives there... I think you know what I mean"
You say, "Fly circles around doesn't imply literally flying circles. It's a figure of speech. :P"
Pallando says, "I guess its up to personal interpretation of the metaphor cause to me fly circles implies more speed than maneuver."

Kyyel says, "Dieter, and then I'm going to go ahead and move on. :) Sorry Pal, I guess I used a bad choice of words."
Dieter would like to point out that Space is a vacuum. A weightless environment. Aerodynamics do not factor in the least bit. Size doesn't mean a thing, weight doesn't mean a thing. A cap ship with 3D maneuver is going to be able to pull off the same stunts as a fighter with 3D maneuver. Yes, it will take a larger amount of space to do this stunt. The maneuverability of a ship is based upon the locations and power of the maneuver thrusters on the ship, not the type of ship it is.
Kyyel ...
You say, "..."

Kyyel says, "Altair has something to say to this that I feel greatly needs to be mentioned. :>"
Nynaeve idling for supper.
Kyyel says, "Then I do, and then we are moving on. :>"
You say, "Fighters are relatively light ships. Freighters are heavier. Capital ships are heaviest. I think it's fair to assume that we can all agree on that based on size alone. Mass has inertia. Intertia is the innate resistance something has to a change in its motion. Mass has inertia in vaccuums, in space, in weightless invironments. It's why astronauts on the moon cannot pick up their landing pod and FLING it back to earth. Thus, by their very nature, fighters are going to be more maneuverable than freighters which are going to be more maneuverable than cap ships."

Dieter says, "The moon isn't a weightless environment. There is gravity involved to hinder the inertia"
Dieter says, "in space you can take something and fling it. It will continue to follow that trajectory until it is caught in a gravity well of another object."
Kyyel says, "Also, there's a reason that even if it could, a capital ship would not preform said manuvers. They're not set up for it. On a cap ship, especially a big one like a SD, you have lots of people walking around doing business like stuff. We've clear examples from the movies of acceleration rushes and tight turns tossing people around inside a ship. Unless the captain of the capital ship wanted to kill like... half his crew doing a fishtail, then the ship isn't capable. Also Dieter, remember that even in weightlessness, several thousand tons is still several thousand tons. Something with a lot of power will have to move it, and it won't happen quickly."

Thomas says, "Then Dieter, you've made the case against you. Tell me where in space you'll not find a galaxy billions of lightyears away exerting gravity on your ship, creating drag despite lack of air resistance? Make that a million stars pulling on you and you've got gravity making ships move differently."

Altair does not deny that. But to initially accelllerate it to give it motion, you will have to supply a force equal to its mass times the acceleration. If you accellerate a 500kg ship to a velocity of 100 m/s in the space of 1 second, you will have to supply 50000N of force.

Kyyel oks, I could probably have a whole class on this very subject guys, but I think we have to move on here. :>
Kyyel says, "Again, I need to ask people, please page me or raise your hand before making a statement. My lil brain can only handle so much telnet here."
Kyyel says, "Now then... *peers to make sure all statements are done ;)* let's move onto some quick Do's and Dont's of space RP."

Kyyel says, "What you should do is try to make sure it is very clear which ship you are. This is especially important if more than 2 vessels are involved in any kind of RP. Use your type of ship (yt-1300, Kale, etc...), or ship class (freighter, fighter, capital), or better still, your name and #. Generally, people pick up on the # pretty quick in RP, but that other information can really help to make sure they can tell who's doing what."

Kyyel says, "Also, keep in mind that while you are flying a large chunk of metal, you can still give it style or emotion. Engines flaring brightly, turning to the ships limits... screaming through space (I know there's no sound in space, but it makes a good pose). All that stuff helps to flesh out space poses, and to add a little spice to the RP."

Kyyel says, "That's it for what to do, now, anyone have anything to add or has a question?"
Kyyel nos? Okay then, moving onto what you should try to avoid. :)

Kyyel says, "Key thing to try to avoid: personal posing. By this, I mean posing what your character is doing, and not your ship. Now, this is all well and fine to do actually... in moderation. But when half or more of your pose is what you are doing, and then you add in a line or two for the ship, it adds a lot of needless information that no one can actually respond to... generally because they can't see you. A quick line or two is fine, but any more than that and it's probably too much."

Kyyel says, "Again, any questions or statements?"
Nesin raises his hand.
Kyyel says, "Nesin."

Nesin says, "If your engaging your ship's engines to full -- would it be good to say "Nesin flicks up several switches, pushing the Sable Seraph's engines to the max." ?"
Nesin says, "(Or, something amung those lines -- bad example)"
Nynaeve notices that Stackpole mixes what Horn is doing in his Xwing with what the ship itself is doing on the outside all the time.
Nynaeve says, "that's not my question though."
Nesin says, "Better example of what I mean .. Inside the cockpit, Nesin taps a few controls in his cockpit, the Sable Seraph's rotary laser cannons turning to focus on the oposing vessel."
Kyyel nods, "That's fine Nesin. But don't get too much past that. And , that is true, but stackpole is writing in a different media as well.
Kyyel says, "errrs, that last part was to Nyn."
Nesin nods.

Nynaeve raises her hand.
Kyyel says, "Yes Nyn. :)"
Nynaeve says, "Something I noticed in the code for our starfighters is...well, from what I am told the evasive maneuver that you choose determines how difficult your next shot is. The only problem is, I don't think it is taking into account the fact that after whatever evasion is made that the pilot will find a way to close with their target before firing. It's like it is set up with the assumption that if we flew away that we are making the shot from some far distance. I think you can get my point."
Kyyel says, "We're not to combat yet Nyn. ;)"
Kyyel says, "But I do have something to say regarding that."
You say, "Also, that's the old space combat system, not the new one. :)"
Kyyel says, "Now then, any other questions or statements? :)"

Kyyel okays. Now, Combat. ;)
Kyyel says, "Combat works just like normal combat in RP would, except you'll be posing your ship's cannons rather than yourself. Basic combat still applies here: keep your attack pose as simple as possible so your opponent knows what's coming at him, and be as descriptive as possible. Also, in space, make sure they know what they're being shot at with. Someone's going to react very very differently if they're being shot at by a proton torpedo rather than blasters."

Kyyel says, "Now, Nesin, could you repeat your question from earlier? I don't quite remember it."
Kyyel says, "Nyn also has a question after you."
Dieter raises his hand and would like to make a comment too.
Kyyel nods, "After these two D.

Nesin says, "You say, "Do stats majorly effect your ability to dodge Ship's weapons fire, and to actually shoot at other ships? (I have 5D+0, and couldn't get a shot off at an attacking ship the other day.) Also . .I noticed, Normally, I would +check around in the 20s for Starship Piloting. But yet I got hit considerably, with 12s as my defence score.""
Long distance to Kyyel: Altair can do a quick rundown on how space combat works, numberswise, if you want

Kyyel says, "Okay, let me respond to this, and then Altair will give a quick rundown on how space works in the numbers sense."
Kyyel says, "Yes, stats majorly affect your ability to dodge and shoot. Do remember though, that hitting other ships isn't easy. Generally, they'll have more bonuses to dodge then you do to shoot. It's common to miss a lot, especially with 5d. :) Also depends on who you're fighting too... you may have been up against an ace. The 12s on your defense just sound like you were having bad rolls."

Kyyel says, "Actually Nyn, go ahead now, Altair needs to gather up some info first. :)"

Nynaeve says, "Okay. First, I wanted to know why the range modifier treats you like you have not closed to shoot after you make your evasive action? The way it is set up is you can only really hit your opponent if you don't make an evasive maneuver and just suck it up. I'd also like to know how someone with 5D+0 sf piloting manages to always outmaneuver the shots of someone with 6d+1 starship gunnery?
That is not my second question. My second question is, how do we use torps when last I heard no one had gotten around to fixing whatever code problem was involved with them?"

Kyyel says, "Okay, first question: because depending on your manuver, you will move away from your opponent. Diving and rolling generally doesn't bring you any closer, and when you reposition, you're just starting to close once more. The code assumes you're taking the shot as soon as possible, because that will probably be the best position you get without having to remanuver. Remember, just because you manuver doesn't mean your opponent is sitting still ICly; you'd both be ducking and weaving all over the place."

Pallando says, "Ship manuver bonues and range mods outweigh size penalty and fire control is why a more skilled gunner misses a less skilled pilot."

Nynaeve says, "Yeah, I know. but you would still wait to get a good shot versus blowing your cannons without getting your target in the heads up display."

Kyyel says, "As for the second question, torps and missiles can be used now, they just do not lose ammo. You are HIGHLY ENCOURAGED to not abuse this, because it's twinky, and no one likes a twink. Fire off as many torps as your fighter would hold, then say you're out of ammo."

Kyyel sighs. Again, please PAGE ME FIRST before making statements. Makes it really really, really hard to respond here.
Kyyel says, "Pallando is right though."

Kyyel says, "And Nyn, as I said, you'd just be starting to close, so the approach would have little significance in difference. It'd be really pointless to have you pose fleeing, then being right up next to your oppoent."

Nynaeve raises her hand to ask permission to respond to that.
Dieter raises his hand again, feeling forgotten. ;)
Kyyel says, "Dieter first, then Nyn."
Kyyel says, "Then Thomas."

Vetch raises his hand looking sheepish.
Kyyel sighs.
Kyyel says, "Not sighing at questions BTW."
Kyyel says, "Vetch, you're after Thomas."

Dieter says, "Alright, pay attention to cbt/log and cbt/display. These help a lot. Don't pose that you easily avoid their shots if your roll was only 1 above theirs. cbt/display will show your ships current position as well as those in your combat group. Use this position in tactics as the combat system moves you around automatically. Pose tactics. A ship with a speed of 120 is likely going to fly past you during his shot as the combat system moves him closer when he shoots. The cbt system isn't perfect, but its better than most systems I've seen.
Take for instance, Axel's attack on the imperials. I was posing that I was lobbing shots at long range at a corvette. The fighters were fully upgraded TIEMK2INT's and every time they shot at me, they flew past me. Remember that in your poses and tactics in combat. If you move away from one target, its going to put you closer to another target. When I got at extreme ranges from the corvette, roll+awaying from the fighters put me closer to it where my shots weren't getting such negatives to hit. When the fighters would attack again, they'd overfly me and roll+away put me back where I started. They saw that as cheesy, but I was watching my positioning and targeting a corvette. Keep an eye on range always."

Kyyel says, "Well said Dieter, personally, I think it may not be possible to continue with the same manuver each time (your opponent would begin to anticipate it), but you make a good point."

Nynaeve says, "Okay, one thing I wanted to say was that when we follow our evasive maneuvers with a pose, we pose both moving away and then closing for our attack and making the attack, following it with the roll to shoot...that's what I was talking about the range modifier being off. Anyways, my question is if we are paired up to go one on one in a combat group, how are we suppose to pick a closer target to lob our shots at when the only other ship in the combat group is the one we are going head to head with?"

Thomas is gonna have to jet before my turn. Dieter'll ask for me and I'll catch the answer in the log. Thanks Kyyel and everybody.
Kyyel nods and got that Thomas. Thanks for coming.

Kyyel says, "You'd have to be in a combat group with more people then Nyn. No other way about that."

Thomas sticks a banana on the desk as he quietly leaves.
Thomas has disconnected.

Kyyel says, "Okay, Dieter in place of Thomas, and then Vetch. :)"
Nynaeve says, "so no one stuck in a combat group with just only one person can benefit from what Dieter was saying."
Kyyel shakes his head, "Unfortunately, no."

Dieter says, "Well, here goes I'll just paste it instead of re-wording it.:
Thomas pages: It goes back to what you said about the defense and automoving, if its not covered beforehand ask something along these lines. OK, now in the new space combat code it automatically moves your ship, now in my fights since space combat has been changed my opponent ends up really close for his shots and then I end up moved from my defense and have to take a long shot, is that just how it is or is there some way to make combat not move you your max distance each round?"

Kyyel says, "There's no real way around it; slowing down in combat is pretty suicidal except under certain conditions, so you'd be keeping your engines at full burn to make yourself harder to hit. Best thing to try to do is manuver in a way that keeps you close, but understand you might take a hit from it."

Kyyel says, "Now then, Vetch. :)"
Vetch says, "How do I find out information on space combat in general, like where can I find commands and such."
Kyyel says, "Any navcomp in a ship has all the space combat commands listed out in help files. :)"
Kyyel says, "cbt/help will be the files you want."
Vetch says, "thanks I was wondering about that."
Kyyel says, "Now then, Nynaeve has another question."

Nynaeve says, "Yes, I was wondering if in the future starfighters could be paired up in combat groups in pairs in the future. We should be flying with our wingmen anyways- looking out for one another to a degree. This would also give us the chance to take advantage of what Dieter was telling us about as far as choosing our targets."


Dieter raises his hand once more.
Kyyel says, "That's something you need to work out beforehand when the combats are set up ."
Kyyel says, "Dieter."
Arands sneaks in quietly.
Arands has arrived.
Kyyel says, "Hello Arands. :)"
Arands wavers. Did I miss the whole thing?
Nynaeve sticks exploding snaps in Arands path so he makes lots of noise coming inside.
Kyyel umms, "Kinda... we're working on the last bits of combat.
Arands says, "Space?"
Kyyel nods.
Arands settles in to listen. Might have some points to add, but I'll page them once I know where things are in the class.

Dieter says, "In comment to that Nyn, it factors down to this. Time constraints. Multiple ships engaging tagets is very time consuming. Especially when using lasers which at anything other than real close range miss quite often. Pairing off simplifies and speeds up the combat groups and such, but at the price of choosing a target. In a perfect environment, where time constraints don't apply, it would be easy to work it out so that combat scenes involve multiple ships. And in my opinion, it's better rp if its more than a duel. But once again, duels take time, but are a lot faster than pair vs. pair. Instead of 2 people posing and shooting and defending, you have 4 or more. What ICly took axel around 3 minutes at Selene took more than 2 hours because there were more than 2 ships involved."

Nesin raises his hand.
Kyyel says, "Again Dieter, that's something that needs to be decided beforehand. Sometimes though, you will have more ships against one target, simply due to the nature of it. Now then, Altair has her information set, then Nesin has a question."


You say, "This is long. Those on telnet will probably cry."
You say, "Okay. This will be rough b/c I don't have the exact specs with me and I'm working off of memory here. So bear with me. :) Most of you have probably already figured most of this out. Anyone who has used space combat before has seen the readout of one's attack and defense numbers.
Attacks depend on 3 things. They depend on your own skill, your weapon's fire control, and the range you are at at the time you fire the weapons. The final score is modified positively by the skill roll of starship/starfighter/capship piloting, and the fire control roll of the weapon you are firing. Attack rolls are modified negatively by the range at the time of firing. Attacks assume that you are moving towards your opponents position at the maximum speed, so after you fire, you will be moved space units towards your opponent. The fire control penalty is based off of WEG, I think. If you look at a misc/status for your ship, you'll see something like
-Weapon Status- Range Mods (Neg Dice)
0- 11- 101- > Fire
Num Name Ammo 10: 100: 500: 500: Ctrl
1 Class 4 Single Laser Cannon Inf. 1 2 3 4 3
2 Class 4 Single Laser Cannon Inf. 1 2 3 4 3

If you are within 10 units of your opponent, 1D will be rolled as a penalty. 11-100, 2D, etc. This number will be subtracted from your score.

Defense scores are calculated using 3 factors as well. They are your roll of starship/starfighter/capship piloting, a maneuvering bonus, and a size penalty. The roll is just a straight roll of your skill. The maneuvering bonus is based on some percentage of your ship's speed and is added to your score. I can't remember exactly how it is calculated. And the ship size is a percentage of your ship's size and is subtracted from your score. Your choice of defenses will influence how much you move towards or away from your opponent. Charge will move you full speed towards them. Bank and roll will move you percentages of your max speed.

You say, "Space code cannot be expected to be all things to all people, and it never will be. The way it is now, it's very flexible, and many things can be left up to the user's preferences when setting up battle groups (number of people in combat groups, when to fire, how many times, whether shield refreshing should count as a turn or can be done anytime, etc). Also note that nav/auto is disabled when in combat, but nav/moveto still works (should you prefer to use that in place of an attack one round). The system was designed for smaller, one on one battles, which is why I think groups are usually split up, but in theory, combat groups can be bigger."

Nesin says, "My ship has two dinky, and useless Laser Cannons. Do you know when the weapon change code will be imputted, so I can make my ships weapons 'beefier', so to speak?"
Kyyel says, "No idea. :)"
Nesin nods.
You say, "No ETA"

Kyyel says, "Now, Arands has a statement he'd like to make about shields that I think is valuable. Go ahead A. :)"
Arands says, "No BLT!"
Arands says, "sorry"
Kyyel blinks.
Arands says, "yes... one sec.. this won't take long to type out"
Nesin drools at the thought of the toasted warm bread, with fluffy white mayo, crisp bacon, fresh cut tomatoes and crunchy lettuce.
Nynaeve smacks Nesin out of it. "You're drooling on my shoulder."
Kyyel shhs.
Kyyel :)

Arands says, "Basically, ever since CBT/REFRESH became available, it has been used and in my mind, abused. Something the Empire and I have been discussing has been 'WHEN' it appropriate to refresh shields in combat. Basically, if you can refresh anytime you want, you'll never get to the end of a battle.
Basically, using CBT/REFRESH needs to be worked out with others in your cbt group ahead of time. Some might prefer to refresh every single round. Which doesn't give you many points, by the way. The NR and Empire are going to try something, I think, where if you refresh your shields, you are diverting power from your weapons, so will not be able to fire the next time it's your turn. You must pose dodging while your shields charge. It's straight from the PnP: You get ONE action per combat turn. Fire a weapon or refresh shields."

Kyyel smiles, "Very well stated Arands. :)
Kyyel says, "Now then, does anyone have any last questions or statements they'd like to make?"
Dieter raises his hands

Arands says, "but - it boils down to consent and mutal agreement. If everyone involved decides to refresh whenever, it's up to you - but it should always be worked out BEFORE you refresh the first time"
Arands passes the floor back

Kyyel nods his head once to Arands, and smiles, "Thank you again. Even I wasn't completely clear on it. Now then, Dieter, and then I'm going to wrap this up.

Dieter says, "I'd actually like to see the cbt/refresh displayed on the screen. No, cbt/shields refresh doesn't raise your current shield points, but it does take an action to perform. I've been in a fight one time where I was facing a STRIKE cruiser. one minute I hit it's hulls, then we used the rule that refreshing shields took an action. The person had apparently been using the refresh command quite a bit during the fight because when he went typed cbt/shields to raise them back to the current max level, they went nearly all the way up. The person was kind enough to share their sheet with me and I'm sorry, 3D+1 isn't enough to raise shields to max on one attempt"

Kyyel says, "Again Dieter, things like this should be brought to the wizards attention. :) I'm afraid I don't warrant that high on the food chain yet."
Nynaeve laughs.

Arands says, "CBT is displayed... they have to RAISE shields again for the new rating to be in affect"

Kyyel says, "But I will say taht depending on their total shield level does have an effect. If they don't have much shielding, then they won't have to roll as high to raise it."
Dieter says, "Yes, but the act of refreshing potential shield points takes an action, does it not?"

Arands says, "err CBT/refresh isn't, but they have to do a CBT/SHIELDS to regain the points as active"

Dieter raises his hand again
Kyyel says, "Now then, afraid I'm going to have to put a hold on all statements to finish this up. Yes Dieter, Arands had just mentioned that in the shield etiquette."

Kyyel says, "Shield refreshing should take an action, according to what arands just said. They're testing it now."

You say, "The amount you're able to refresh is based both on TIME since the last refresh and Skill, though you'd have to ask Darrien the specifics."

Kyyel says, "Now then, my final thing for combat: Damage. Only the person who takes the damage poses the damage. They know their ship better than you do, and also know how much they've taken. It should be posed immediately after the shot that hit it as well, and it should be clear if something rather obvious got blown off (most systems that you'd lose would be noticed, even communications cause your ship gets really quiet in frequencies). If NPCs are involved, then the person controlling the NPCs poses the damage. :)"

Kyyel says, "Now then, that's it for space RP and combat! Hope you all enjoyed the class, and I hope you all got something from it!"
Arands takes his tardy slip and goes to the Principal's office
Darian throws an apple pie at Ky.

Dibar sneaks in quietly.
Dibar has arrived.
Dibar walks in like he's not late at all, and sits down.
Altair laughs
Kyyel says, "class dismissed. ;)"
As everyone else gets up.

Dieter stands up and turns to head for the door.

Altair edits the log for Minkar so she can post it. For THOSE WHO WERE LATE. ;)